New JDpower ranking

ScBlacksunshine · 06-07-2006, 02:37 PM

here's the new JDpower ranking report, looks like BMW went down, we're now at below industry avg for problems per vehicle

KC Bimmer · 06-07-2006, 02:41 PM

That's surprising . . .

Lexus huh?

ksfrogman · 06-07-2006, 02:53 PM

Lexus and Toyota do not surprise me. What surprises me is that Porsche is above that, and that Hyundai is ranked so high.

rchanou · 06-07-2006, 02:58 PM

What surprises me is that Jaguar is right below Toyota and above Honda.

e90fan1234 · 06-07-2006, 03:06 PM

Is the BMW number of 142 below that of 2005? Or is it an imporovement? Just wondering if BMW has fallen or is it more that the industry as a whole has advanced?

Asiann · 06-07-2006, 03:15 PM

Surprised at the makers at the top of the list. I guess Hyundai has improved.

325Driver · 06-07-2006, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e90fan1234

Is the BMW number of 142 below that of 2005? Or is it an imporovement? Just wondering if BMW has fallen or is it more that the industry as a whole has advanced?

Last year we bettered the industry average.

leitrim · 06-07-2006, 03:18 PM

Jag in the top 5? Wow, I've never once heard Jag and quality used in the same sentence.

siriusinvestor · 06-07-2006, 03:20 PM

I guess they excluded the reliability rating of the Jaguar X Type.

Oz · 06-07-2006, 03:20 PM

Does this really mean much for car enthusiasts? I don't get the point of these kind of rankings especially because I don't agree with most of it

Hunter399 · 06-07-2006, 03:37 PM

ekkkk

Mercedes use to be at the bottomm, now they are above BMW

That sucks big time

David328M-Sport · 06-07-2006, 03:39 PM

no probs with my e90 after 11 months of ownership.

in 6.5 years with e46, indicator assembly needed replacing

in 5.75 years with e36, fan belt broke.

not bad.

shragon · 06-07-2006, 03:39 PM

bmw has dropped below mercedes benz, wow.

ON325i · 06-07-2006, 03:48 PM

I think it is important to give everyone some insight other than just 'zomg handling'. Here is an article from CNN regarding new J.D. Power and Associates Initial Quality Survey. This is the first year they consider design flaws in the ranking and BMW took a hard hit on it. Here is the link but I have quote the section specifically related to our community..

http://www.cnn.com/2006/AUTOS/06/07/...iqs/index.html

Quote:

Vehicle brands can vary widely in the two quality measures.

"For example, BMW vehicles have among the fewest defects and malfunctions, along with Toyota," said Ivers. "But BMW approaches controls and displays in a way that creates some problems for customers, leading to more design-related problems overall than Toyota incurs."

BMW ranked well below average in the survey with 142 problems per 100 vehicles.

A BMW spokesman attributed the large number of design-related issues to the amount of advanced technology in the company's vehicles.

"We are known, and we are expected to be, a leader in cutting edge technology," said David Buchko, a BMW spokesman.

New owners may have trouble using some of the vehicles' technology simply because it is unfimiliar to them, he said.

BiggieJ · 06-07-2006, 03:58 PM

holy crap! kudos to huyndai

whowudathought? ouch BMW is way way down

aphall · 06-07-2006, 04:04 PM

i wonder how the break out would look for each BMW car line.

dejav0o · 06-07-2006, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BiggieJ

holy crap! kudos to huyndai

whowudathought? ouch BMW is way way down

Hyundi has been making some very nice cars lately... they've gone from bottom of the bucket (i.e Kia quality) to a competitive company with honda and toyota. I would say give it a few more years, and people will stop associating that brand as just another cheap car.

wyrm11 · 06-07-2006, 04:22 PM

The part that actually stands out to me about that article is that BMW has as few defects and malfunctions as Toyota. For all the talk about how Japanese cars are more reliable than German cars, I think that says a lot.

Polling on design-related problems is a bit faulty IMO and even if there are problems, they're more easily avoidable than malfunctions.

wyrm11 · 06-07-2006, 04:49 PM

The thing we all have to keep in mind is the CHANGE in the way JD Powers holds their survey now. Here's a CNN article regarding the study that coreslogic posted earlier:

http://www.cnn.com/2006/AUTOS/06/07/...iqs/index.html

UNLIKE previous years, JD Power is now taking into account design flaws in addition to malfunctions and manufacturer defects.

Quote:

This year's scores are not comparable to those of previous years because this year, for the first time, J.D. Power considered design flaws that bother consumers as well as actual defects. Had the ranking been based on defects alone, Lexus would have ranked first and Porsche second.

Here's a notable quote that relates to BMW from the article:

Quote:

Vehicle brands can vary widely in the two quality measures.

"For example, BMW vehicles have among the fewest defects and malfunctions, along with Toyota," said Ivers. "But BMW approaches controls and displays in a way that creates some problems for customers, leading to more design-related problems overall than Toyota incurs."

BMW ranked well below average in the survey with 142 problems per 100 vehicles.

A BMW spokesman attributed the large number of design-related issues to the amount of advanced technology in the company's vehicles.

"We are known, and we are expected to be, a leader in cutting edge technology," said David Buchko, a BMW spokesman.

New owners may have trouble using some of the vehicles' technology simply because it is unfimiliar to them, he said.

Personally, it matters more to me that BMW has fewer defects like Toyota. The design flaws are more easily avoidable than defects such as engine problems.

noflash · 06-07-2006, 04:51 PM

Correct me if I am wrong, but the "Initial" quality refers to the first 3 months of ownership. Ask those Cayenne owners how the quality is after 3 mos.

This study is crap.

Not to mention, it's on a curve for idiots:
"For example, BMW vehicles have among the fewest defects and malfunctions, along with Toyota," said Ivers. "But BMW approaches controls and displays in a way that creates some problems for customers, leading to more design-related problems overall than Toyota incurs."

ON325i · 06-07-2006, 05:10 PM

Okay, after furiously trying to find my lost thread, I found it here.... merged.. heh.

Anyway, yes, they change the way they do the ranking! read my reply above and wyrm11's reply.

and don't get too emotional over just the ranking numbers...

ScBlacksunshine · 06-07-2006, 05:24 PM

Thank you very much for digging up that CNN article and clearing this up. I think it's pretty stupid to include design flaw as part of the survey, I think it'll confuse people even more now. I guess this survey are so mixed in now, it really doesn't bear alot of weight on long term reliability. That might also be the reason why Hyundai have moved up so far up ahead, since they generally copy Toyota/Honda's ergonomic design. One thing for sure though, seems like VW is still near the bottom years after years...hmmm

06-07-2006, 02:37 PM	#1
ScBlacksunshine YUGO is my dream car 144 Rep 1,564 Posts Drives: Bayerische Motoren Werke Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: LBC iTrader: (2)	New JDpower ranking here's the new JDpower ranking report, looks like BMW went down, we're now at below industry avg for problems per vehicle
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06-07-2006, 02:41 PM	#2
KC Bimmer Second Lieutenant 29 Rep 256 Posts Drives: 2013 335i xdrive Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: KC iTrader: (0)	That's surprising . . . Lexus huh?
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06-07-2006, 02:53 PM	#3
ksfrogman Major General 574 Rep 6,750 Posts Drives: E90 330i 6MT Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Torrance, CA iTrader: (12) Garage List 2006 330i [0.00] 2006 330i [0.00]	Lexus and Toyota do not surprise me. What surprises me is that Porsche is above that, and that Hyundai is ranked so high. __________________
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06-07-2006, 02:58 PM	#4
rchanou Private First Class 11 Rep 186 Posts Drives: 325i Jet Black Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Long Beach, CA iTrader: (0) Garage List 2006 325i [0.00]	What surprises me is that Jaguar is right below Toyota and above Honda.
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06-07-2006, 03:06 PM	#5
e90fan1234 Private 4 Rep 66 Posts Drives: 2004 E-46 325i Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Vancouver, WA iTrader: (0)	Is the BMW number of 142 below that of 2005? Or is it an imporovement? Just wondering if BMW has fallen or is it more that the industry as a whole has advanced?
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06-07-2006, 03:15 PM	#6
Asiann Got Seoul? 116 Rep 2,862 Posts Drives: 2012 535i MSport Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Honolulu iTrader: (0) Garage List 2012 BMW 535i [0.00] 2008 750Li [0.00] 2006 BMW [0.00]	Surprised at the makers at the top of the list. I guess Hyundai has improved. __________________ Can you say Alooooha? [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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06-07-2006, 03:18 PM	#8
leitrim Private First Class 4 Rep 103 Posts Drives: Barrique Red 330i Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: SF Bay Area iTrader: (0)	Jag in the top 5? Wow, I've never once heard Jag and quality used in the same sentence.
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06-07-2006, 03:20 PM	#9
siriusinvestor Captain 67 Rep 873 Posts Drives: 1989 Ugo Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: US iTrader: (2)	I guess they excluded the reliability rating of the Jaguar X Type.
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06-07-2006, 03:20 PM	#10
Oz Lieutenant Colonel 33 Rep 1,770 Posts Drives: 2006 330i, 2004 X5 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Wayne, NJ iTrader: (1) Garage List 2006 330i [0.00]	Does this really mean much for car enthusiasts? I don't get the point of these kind of rankings especially because I don't agree with most of it __________________ 2006 330i Steptronic/Alpine White/Black Leather/Burl Walnut Trim/Premium Package/iDrive/Heated Seats/Winter: STYLE 159 Blizzak LM-22 RFT/Summer: TBD 2004 X5 Steptronic/Alpine White/Grey Leather/Poplar Trim/Premium Package/Heated Seats/iPod Adapter
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06-07-2006, 03:37 PM	#11
Hunter399 Major General 323 Rep 8,091 Posts Drives: F90M5 Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Houston, TX iTrader: (33)	ekkkk Mercedes use to be at the bottomm, now they are above BMW That sucks big time
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06-07-2006, 03:39 PM	#12
David328M-Sport Brigadier General 101 Rep 3,566 Posts Drives: F30 M-Sport 328i Estoril Blue Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Melbourne Australia iTrader: (0)	no probs with my e90 after 11 months of ownership. in 6.5 years with e46, indicator assembly needed replacing in 5.75 years with e36, fan belt broke. not bad. __________________ 328i M-Sport, Estoril Blue, Carbon XP 35 Tint, front heated seats, black Dakota, Sports Suspension, Anthracite Headliner, HUD, Pro Nav, Sunroof, hk 600w, Bi-Xenon, 19" 403M wheels, Reversing Camera, DAB+, Xenon, BT Ext Connect, MST turbo intake pipe, MST Cold Air Intake, JB4 on Map 2 with Catless DP produces awesome performance in Sport.
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06-07-2006, 03:39 PM	#13
shragon Moderator 497 Rep 27,441 Posts Drives: BMW Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Bay Area, CA iTrader: (7)	bmw has dropped below mercedes benz, wow. __________________ www.cardomain.com/id/shragon
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06-07-2006, 03:58 PM	#15
BiggieJ Second Lieutenant 62 Rep 239 Posts Drives: e92 335 ZSPZPPOPP Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: SoCal iTrader: (0)	holy crap! kudos to huyndai whowudathought? ouch BMW is way way down
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06-07-2006, 04:04 PM	#16
aphall Captain 34 Rep 776 Posts Drives: 330i rec'd 2/17/06 Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Los Angeles, CA iTrader: (2) Garage List 2006 BMW 330i [0.00]	i wonder how the break out would look for each BMW car line. __________________ JB \| BBS CHs \| Blacklines \| HO40 \| ACS Rep Roof Spoiler \| H&R Sport \| Hartge Rep Lip \| OEM Strut Bar \| M-Tech Rear
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06-07-2006, 04:22 PM	#18
wyrm11 ///Man of Steel 30 Rep 1,243 Posts Drives: Monaco 335 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: CA iTrader: (0)	The part that actually stands out to me about that article is that BMW has as few defects and malfunctions as Toyota. For all the talk about how Japanese cars are more reliable than German cars, I think that says a lot. Polling on design-related problems is a bit faulty IMO and even if there are problems, they're more easily avoidable than malfunctions.
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06-07-2006, 04:51 PM	#20
noflash Captain Caveman 148 Rep 1,715 Posts Drives: '06 325eyeyiyi Join Date: May 2005 Location: midwest iTrader: (0) Garage List 2006 325i [0.00]	Correct me if I am wrong, but the "Initial" quality refers to the first 3 months of ownership. Ask those Cayenne owners how the quality is after 3 mos. This study is crap. Not to mention, it's on a curve for idiots: "For example, BMW vehicles have among the fewest defects and malfunctions, along with Toyota," said Ivers. "But BMW approaches controls and displays in a way that creates some problems for customers, leading to more design-related problems overall than Toyota incurs." __________________ E90 325i Monaco Blue, Black Leatherette, Sport, Cold Weather, Xenon, Sat Prep, 18" BBS RGR Mods: Polorized Film for Business CD, added lumbar, rock chip on hood
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06-07-2006, 05:10 PM	#21
ON325i Captain 18 Rep 740 Posts Drives: e90 325i Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Toronto, Canada iTrader: (0) Garage List 2006 e90 325i [0.00]	Okay, after furiously trying to find my lost thread, I found it here.... merged.. heh. Anyway, yes, they change the way they do the ranking! read my reply above and wyrm11's reply. and don't get too emotional over just the ranking numbers... __________________ e90 325i Jet Black / Sports Pkg / Auto
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06-07-2006, 05:24 PM	#22
ScBlacksunshine YUGO is my dream car 144 Rep 1,564 Posts Drives: Bayerische Motoren Werke Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: LBC iTrader: (2)	Thank you very much for digging up that CNN article and clearing this up. I think it's pretty stupid to include design flaw as part of the survey, I think it'll confuse people even more now. I guess this survey are so mixed in now, it really doesn't bear alot of weight on long term reliability. That might also be the reason why Hyundai have moved up so far up ahead, since they generally copy Toyota/Honda's ergonomic design. One thing for sure though, seems like VW is still near the bottom years after years...hmmm
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