[richardbb85]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

I think DC has taken the red light violation one step further. If you cross the solid white line where you're supposed to stop on red, you're issued a red light violation regardless of whether you actually crossed into the intersection or not. The rationale is they're enforcing pedestrian safety by keeping drivers from encroaching into the crosswalks.

few years ago in ny, police were waiting at busy intersection lights to ticket people like that. all they needed was 2 sec, point the machine to ur vin and bam, ticket out.

[NickyC]

Those fines are outrageous. Say what you will about this guy breaking the law and running red lights, any fine over $100 from a camera is criminal.

Check around, if you don't need to pay them DON'T. Maybe you'll be lucky in your jurisdiction and have these moronic devices pulled out like we did here in St. Louis. If nobody pays them, they go away.

If you don't pay, be prepared for a lot of nasty letters which have no teeth. They'll look mean, but there's nothing backing the enforcement of them.

Finally, just stop running red lights. I'm more against speed cameras than red light cameras honestly.

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by NickyC

Those fines are outrageous. Say what you will about this guy breaking the law and running red lights, any fine over $100 from a camera is criminal.

Check around, if you don't need to pay them DON'T. Maybe you'll be lucky in your jurisdiction and have these moronic devices pulled out like we did here in St. Louis. If nobody pays them, they go away.

If you don't pay, be prepared for a lot of nasty letters which have no teeth. They'll look mean, but there's nothing backing the enforcement of them.

Finally, just stop running red lights. I'm more against speed cameras than red light cameras honestly.

Run a red light in Europe and your facing some serious fines. In Germany its around 400 euros AND you loose your license for one to three months.... AND the longer the light is red, when you ran it... the HIGHER the fine will be.

We have no turn right on red light laws in Germany/Europe. So run the light and your gonna pay.


Dack

[Blksnowflake]

I understand the fines might be high, so go to court and fight them, get a lawyer if need be.
But I don't get the idea that you are somehow not responsible or liable, you broke the law so time to be an adult and own up.
If someone were hurt by your actions which is a possibility if you broke a law, especially a red light then would it still be ok to get over on the "man" because it was in another county.

[Delta0311]

They pretty much disabled these things in NJ.. Turns out we where all right when people claimed that the shortened the yellow light.

[John 070]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

What is there to fight? The citation comes in the mail with pictures of your car and your license plate. The first picture is of your car at the intersection tripping the inductive loop sensor in the pavement. This shot will also show the light is red. The next picture will be of your car going through the intersection with the light still red. The system records how long the light was red and how fast you were going.

In the jurisdictions around me, this type of ticket is non moving violation type infraction where you're only responsible for the fine with no points or official entry into your driving record. And if you're thinking about fighting it saying you weren't driving the car, the municipalities have that covered too. The registered owner would be responsible for naming the individual driving the car at the time of the infraction.

Interesting thing is these systems are supposed to offer a grace for x ms. Meaning, the cams arm a split second after red. If you are completing your turn on green or yellow and the light turns red, in most cases you are ok (people say some states say you cannot enter on green and get caught--wtf and where are these states?).

My buddy emailed me a link from Tampa FLA when he got one--it was so bogus, I burst out laughing. He was stone cold busted. But what was interesting was he was car#2 to blow the red light. I clearly saw a flash when he did so. There was no flash with the Audi in front of him, implying the first car got a pass. And there was no question both cars had not reached the stop line before the light turned red.

I believe in RLCs, I am not for speed cams although they tend to give 10 mph leeways even in NYC (12 in MD), however, for fines to be around $600 in Calif. is a bit much. $110 imho is fair.

If you can really simply ignore them, then they are not effective and the cities are wasting time installing them (I heard they pay nothing, the co. that administers them gets a cut of fines)....

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by John 070

Interesting thing is these systems are supposed to offer a grace for x ms. Meaning, the cams arm a split second after red. If you are completing your turn on green or yellow and the light turns red, in most cases you are ok (people say some states say you cannot enter on green and get caught--wtf and where are these states?).

My buddy emailed me a link from Tampa FLA when he got one--it was so bogus, I burst out laughing. He was stone cold busted. But what was interesting was he was car#2 to blow the red light. I clearly saw a flash when he did so. There was no flash with the Audi in front of him, implying the first car got a pass. And there was no question both cars had not reached the stop line before the light turned red.

I believe in RLCs, I am not for speed cams although they tend to give 10 mph leeways even in NYC (12 in MD), however, for fines to be around $600 in Calif. is a bit much. $110 imho is fair.

If you can really simply ignore them, then they are not effective and the cities are wasting time installing them (I heard they pay nothing, the co. that administers them gets a cut of fines)....

That's how they work around here. Some x amount of ms after the light goes red before the camera is active.

I was in that situation in DC. My car was in the intersection when the light just went red. A cab behind decided to blow through the light which triggered the Polaroid moment. I was getting myself prepared to fight it if I received something in the mail. I never did.

I was talking to a DC Metro cop once about the speed cameras. He said if there is a picture of another car in the frame to go fight it. And he said the chances of me winning would be pretty good as you can make a case of the speed camera not differentiating on which car was the one causing the infraction.

[ouchie]

I did NOT run a red light, I was making a Right Turn

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by ouchie

I did NOT run a red light, I was making a Right Turn

That clarifies some things.

Did you come to a complete stop or at least roll through at a slow speed? I'm seeing on the upper header of the photos some reference to 45MPH. I hope you weren't zipping through that turn at that speed.

[jwzimm]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

That clarifies some things.

Did you come to a complete stop or at least roll through at a slow speed? I'm seeing on the upper header of the photos some reference to 45MPH. I hope you weren't zipping through that turn at that speed.

The 45mph appears to be the limit. There is a listing for "Vehicle Speed" which seems to indicate either 5 or 15 mph.

[Dracon]

Originally Posted by ouchie

I did NOT run a red light, I was making a Right Turn

What do the signs say on the pole and to the right side of the road? They kind look like No Right on Red signs to me, but the picture quality is too terrible to actually read them.

[MightyMouseTech]

Originally Posted by SakhirM4

Sell your car to pay for tickets. Solves both your "no money" problem and your "running red lights" problem. Problem solved

And prevent him from killing somebody by running red lights.

[RickFLM4]

Originally Posted by Dracon

What do the signs say on the pole and to the right side of the road? They kind look like No Right on Red signs to me, but the picture quality is too terrible to actually read them.

Could also be "this lane right turn only"

That much money for turning right where not allowed is absurd (if that's the case), particularly with no traffic coming.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by jwzimm

The 45mph appears to be the limit. There is a listing for "Vehicle Speed" which seems to indicate either 5 or 15 mph.

Thanks. Couldn't make out the other stuff and figured that would be the speed limit in that area. Couldn't imagine anyone whipping around the turn at that speed.

[jwzimm]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

Thanks. Couldn't make out the other stuff and figured that would be the speed limit in that area. Couldn't imagine anyone whipping around the turn at that speed.

Yeah, I would imagine there would be more smoke from the rear end if one were to attempt that maneuver.

[John 070]

Is that red car even a BMW? I know people who got rlc tix for not coming to a complete stop, and also where there is no turn on red. If neither if the above apply, then whomever reviewed the violation made a mistake. But two times is odd.

[okusa]

Is there at least one photo with a clear shot of your face behind the wheel? If not, there's absolutely nothing they can do to enforce the ticket.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by okusa

Is there at least one photo with a clear shot of your face behind the wheel? If not, there's absolutely nothing they can do to enforce the ticket.

Wrong. Depends on the locality. In the DC metro area, the registered owner is responsible for the ticket. If you weren't the driver, it's your obligation/responsibility to report who did. If you don't pay, you lose your ability to renew your registration.

[okusa]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

Wrong. Depends on the locality. In the DC metro area, the registered owner is responsible for the ticket. If you weren't the driver, it's your obligation/responsibility to report who did. If you don't pay, you lose your ability to renew your registration.

WRONG. No "metro area" law is superior to the Constitution. Every state must produce proof "beyond a reasonable doubt" to find an individual guilty of the offense charged. You cannot be forced to incriminate yourself OR implicate anyone else.

[RickFLM4]

Originally Posted by okusa

WRONG. No "metro area" law is superior to the Constitution. Every state must produce proof "beyond a reasonable doubt" to find an individual guilty of the offense charged. You cannot be forced to incriminate yourself OR implicate anyone else.

This is the way it was in South Florida as well... before they starting ditching the cameras.

[okusa]

Originally Posted by RickFLM4

This is the way it was in South Florida as well... before they starting ditching the cameras.

Correct. They ditched the cameras because they violated the law.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by okusa

WRONG. No "metro area" law is superior to the Constitution. Every state must produce proof "beyond a reasonable doubt" to find an individual guilty of the offense charged. You cannot be forced to incriminate yourself OR implicate anyone else.

You keep saying that around here in the 3 DC metro area jurisdictions and see how far that gets you. If anything, this area has more lawyers per capita than any other place in the country. If what you say is true, then the lawyers here would have gone to town with all 3 municipalities. Yet not one jurisdiction has repealed any of their laws nor pulled their cameras.

In fact, DC has continued to expand their red light and speed camera programs...same as the various counties in Maryland. Fairfax county in Virginia was the exception in pulling the red light cameras but there's been talk about starting up the program again.