[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by Thik

Can't think of why any one would buy any other car.

Can't be your only car.

[Alpine F31]

Originally Posted by pikkagtr

Because maybe I'd like yo drive cross country
Maybe I'd like to drive to LA from the bay area
Maybe I'd like to pass up cars while already driving at 60+mph
Maybe I'd like to go on a track and do MORE than 1 lap
Maybe I'd like to be able to drive on the canyon roads and have some fun
Maybe I don't like the idea of running out of power in the back of my head with less than 40mile range, and decided I'd like to drive some more with out having to find a charging station
Maybe I'd like my sedan to weigh less than 5000lbs

All of this plus; maybe I like some sound with my motion. I drove a Tesla and no doubt the acceleration was amazing, but there is nothing viceral about it. I didn't get out of it wanting one. If I were to go electric, I'd get a basic commuter to daily like a Fiat 500e or BMW i3, then spend the left over $50K on a fun car with an ICE.

[Alpine F31]

Originally Posted by Fanta

All because Tesla interior is like a Honda Civic DX

Ha! Come on, it's not that good.

[FogCityM3]

Actually, unwittingly, we are all buying Teslas and helping putting America in Teslas via the $7,500 subsidized Federal tax credit (not to mention various State ones). Enjoy the car and of course, you're welcome!

[Unknown_Car]

Cyclops- yes oil companys will try to destroy electric cars... thats where the money is, also the goverment controls alot as well why would they let it all go and loose billions of dollars lol

[AW335TT]

Originally Posted by Roma_335xi

Cyclops- yes oil companys will try to destroy electric cars... thats where the money is, also the goverment controls alot as well why would they let it all go and loose billions of dollars lol

Not only just the government.. Imagine if all gas station owners had to shut down, mechanic shop owners, after market tuners, steel/aluminum suppliers, manufacturers, etc.. It would cause a lot of businesses (big and small) to shut down.

[Nkc]

Its kind of like watch porn on mute. Yeah its great and all but I still need the moaning and buildup.

[pikkagtr]

Originally Posted by Nkc

It kind of like watch porn on mute. Yeah its great and all but I still need the moaning and buildup.

dont forget these noises

[pikkagtr]

Originally Posted by Vigilante375

You can drive cross country. Charging stations are everywhere.
LA to bay area, not familiar with that route.
Passing isn't much of an issue at 60. Go look at some reviews, like for the new 70D model.
The car was NEVER made to compete on the track. NEVER. Go buy a Miata or BRZ/FRS or VW Rabbit. Its a family car that just happens to have amazing 0-60 times because of its electric motors. Please read about Tesla instead of blabbing like everyone else about racing around a track.
It handles fairly well for how heavy it is, so you can still have a little fun.
Yes, running out of juice is a buzz kill but thats the chance you take if you go out for an adventure.
I'd like to have a sedan weigh less than 3k full of fuel and oils. Like an SS but weigh under 3k....



Tesla has talked about swapping batteries at charging stations. I don't know if they are doing that 100% now but they've said "Swapping a dead battery for a fully charged one takes less time than filling up a gas powered vehicle". Which is better than waiting for it to charge, even with a supercharger.

They don't have bad passing times anymore. I would love to own a Tesla but theres no reason for me to have own. I still love the old gas powered engine feel.

Oh and by the way, Tesla charging stations are FREE. Unless you do the battery swap, then thats like $70 or something like that. And you ever truly give the middle finger to oil companies.....how do all of those parts get to Tesla's production facility? Not by electric vehicles.

If you think passing at 60+ mph in a Tesla is adequate, especially the 70D you havent tried to or seen one try to pass a f8x with DPs+JB4 on the freeway.
Even the P85D will be left in the dust, and it traps low 110 mphs and the 70D is even slower....
C/D TEST RESULTS:

Zero to 60 mph: 5.1 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 13.4 sec
Zero to 130 mph: 31.0 sec
Rolling start, 5-60 mph: 5.1 sec
Top gear, 30-50 mph: 2.0 sec
Top gear, 50-70 mph: 3.1 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 13.8 sec @ 101 mph

BTW a STOCK f80x is 8.5secs to 100mph

C/D TEST RESULTS:

Zero to 60 mph: 3.8 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 8.5 sec
Zero to 130 mph: 14.5 sec
Zero to 160 mph: 25.8 sec
Rolling start, 5-60 mph: 4.5 sec
Top gear, 30-50 mph: 1.9 sec
Top gear, 50-70 mph: 2.7 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 12.0 sec @ 119 mph


A boat also handles fairly well for how heavy it is, as when I drive my friend's 70d , that it reminds me of steering my brother's Boston Whaler 285 Conquest 30 foot boat when we go fishing for Halibut off the Bay


What if I decide to drive around in Montana to visit relatives? are there any stations there? since you say they are everywhere!
Maybe YOU should "read about Tesla instead of blabbing" stupid misinformation and ill-informed "stats"

[vsix]

Originally Posted by rr006rbc

I still enjoy hearing the hum of an engine and the roar they make when you're at WOT. Yes these things make instant torque and the power created by them is extraordinary but it just doesn't do it for me.

I do enjoy driving the i3, Teslas, etc but it's just not for me at this point in life. Maybe once I'm 65 years of age and don't care too much about cars anymore. MAYBE.

Maybe because long term studie's aren't present regarding the electro smog that surround's you while driving.
Governmental studie's allready proved that your mobile phone benfit's the growth of cancer cell's.- just think about it-
Listen to my word's, in 15-20 year's when this electro- hype is over everything will come out and the tremendous stress that such an electric vehicle put's on an human body will be finally revealed.
To sum it up:
Maybe because it's an health risk.

As I alway's say ONLY BECAUSE there's something new outthere, doesn't mean it can't hurt you.
Don't be so dumb and be a victim as Audrey Hepburn or the Marlboro man and many unknown other's were at their time of age.

[Thik]

Originally Posted by py0413

Because it is my money and I don't want to spend it on a tesla. And congratulations on your newly purchase, the M3 will find a new home soon. ;-)

I didn't buy a Tesla...yet. My M3 is still much more fun to drive even if it feels slower off the line.

After the test drive, it just made me feel relieved that there's an awesome car waiting for me when the M3 retires. I don't really track or drive across the country, so for 99% of the time, the Tesla is a better car.

Tesla has been making cars for ten years, imagine if they had 100 years like the other car companies, how great would that car would be. It's the future and honestly Tesla is improving on an iPhone on wheels and most other car companies are sticking with a rotary phone.

In a rotary phone, you can talk for days without worry about battery life and no electromagnetic heath concerns right? But would you go back to a rotary phone?

[carzaddict]

honestly, it all comes down to personal choice/needs/wants

Tesla makes GREAT cars...but its not for everyone. I drive to canada and back often....as far as i know there arent any charging stations which basically makes the trip impossible. If there was a charging station, i would need approx 20-30 minutes to recharge....time added to an already long trip.

When tesla finally starts doing the battery swap....it'll make the decision easier. but unfortunately its not available at the moment.

[GuidoK]

I don't see the resembalance between Iphone and tesla?
If any, the model S is the rotary phone. With any electric car, you're more dependable. Not only on range (there are much more ordinary petrol stations than supercharge stations, yet the range of the electric car is less), and if you live in a big city, in for instance an appartment and need to park the car on the street, you can't refuel from your home socket. So for a lot of living areas (maybe less in the us as most live in a suburb) an electric car hardly is an option.
They should have made the thing a hybrid with a small petrol engine (room enough), that would have extended it's usability.

As for never meant to be a performance car: tesla boasts enough about p85d's performance as according to them 'it matches the mclaren F1'.
As if 0-60mph is the definition of performance (only for people who cant steer a car I think)

For an electric car the tesla S is probably now the best you can get, but battery technology still has far to go. It's not the electric motor that is the limiting factor (an 700hp small electric motor that fits on the rear axle is '60's tech, every tramcart has one...)

[Vigilante375]

Originally Posted by pikkagtr

If you think passing at 60+ mph in a Tesla is adequate, especially the 70D you havent tried to or seen one try to pass a f8x with DPs+JB4 on the freeway.
Even the P85D will be left in the dust, and it traps low 110 mphs and the 70D is even slower....
C/D TEST RESULTS:

Zero to 60 mph: 5.1 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 13.4 sec
Zero to 130 mph: 31.0 sec
Rolling start, 5-60 mph: 5.1 sec
Top gear, 30-50 mph: 2.0 sec
Top gear, 50-70 mph: 3.1 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 13.8 sec @ 101 mph

BTW a STOCK f80x is 8.5secs to 100mph

C/D TEST RESULTS:

Zero to 60 mph: 3.8 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 8.5 sec
Zero to 130 mph: 14.5 sec
Zero to 160 mph: 25.8 sec
Rolling start, 5-60 mph: 4.5 sec
Top gear, 30-50 mph: 1.9 sec
Top gear, 50-70 mph: 2.7 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 12.0 sec @ 119 mph


A boat also handles fairly well for how heavy it is, as when I drive my friend's 70d , that it reminds me of steering my brother's Boston Whaler 285 Conquest 30 foot boat when we go fishing for Halibut off the Bay


What if I decide to drive around in Montana to visit relatives? are there any stations there? since you say they are everywhere!
Maybe YOU should "read about Tesla instead of blabbing" stupid misinformation and ill-informed "stats"

Charging stations.....http://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger Scroll down a tad. They are adding more each year. They are around major roads.

So comparing a M to a family car never intended to compete with an M or anything of that sort.....interesting. Let me show you this comparison of a M to a one:1! Why get an M when its sooooo slow from 60+?

The Tesla was never intended to be fast or a track car. It just happens to be fast from the get go because of the electric motors. Do you need a class on how those things work compared to a gas engine?

Here, lets look at another comparison between something more along the lines of apples to apples. '14 535i x drive vs a '15 70D and '14 S 60.

535i xdrive---------------'14 S 60---------'15 70D
0-60 5.3-------------------5.5---------------5.1
0-100 13.9----------------15.0-------------13.4
50-70 (top gear) 3.8-----2.9---------------3.1
300 ft skid pad .86-------.89---------------.87
weight 4187 lbs----------4323-------------4608
70-0 172 feet-------------174--------------176
1/4 13.9 @ 100-----------14.2 @ 98-------13.8 @ 101

My stats are not ill informed nor misleading. Its yours that misleading. Comparing a car that was never meant to compete with something like a M. Would you like me to give you a comparison of a F80 vs something like a Camaro 1LE? Why spend that much on a M when a 1LE can handle better than a M?

Why so much hate on Tesla? I just don't understand.

[The Wind Breezes]

The Tesla is an exceptional car for around the city and short highway trips. Anyone who has any business owning one can afford some other car or an airplane ticket for "longer" trips.

The real dealbreaker for me is you can't disable stability control. Total BS...just because Elon Musk couldn't handle high power RWD cars* doesn't mean the entire rest of the planet can't either (OK, 98% of them can't, but the rest of us would like a stability control disable, please).

*He spun and wrecked a McLaren F1 in the middle of the freeway in California, lol.

[zer0cool]

Well, I test drove M3 and Tesla on the same day and got a Tesla, because it has power you can use every day on the street without any effort or hassle (or annoying noise). Since 70D does 50-70 in 3 seconds, which is between M3 and ATS-V, that's plenty fast to pass most cars. Oh and passing on local roads is a total breeze as you can see that 30-50 time, it's like step on it, and suddenly 20mph increase and you ve passed the car. Also I can do those things without being annoyed by overly loud noises, and it also just feel so instantaneous.

Also gasoline car 0-60 numbers are almost never realized in real life since they are generally numbers obtained using launch control, which other than for Porsche, is very hard to actually use, if not impossible, in day to day life (also need to assume perfect weather and traction conditions). So the real to 60 numbers are more likely the 5-60 numbers, assuming perfect weather conditions and traction. Tesla numbers, especially given dual motors today, are easily attainable by anyone whenever. No need to set to sport plus, ESC off, etc etc, just step on pedal and there it is... Given my driving habits on regular roads, and after owning and testing numerous cars in recent years, pretty much the numbers I care about are 5-60, 30-50 and 50-70. In all of these categories, Tesla does wonders. When I test drove both cars, I honestly didn't feel the M3 being faster on regular roads even when I pushed the gear response to 3 bars (well also at 3 bars the car became very annoyingly loud... which I hate).

I don't care about acceleration above 70mph... who cares if my car takes 5 seconds to go 70 to 90 while your car does it in 3... I have never driven at 90mph on public road in my life and never intend to. Like when I get on freeway, I simple accelerate to somewhere between 60-70, then just tap on cruise control, set it to the general traffic speed... that's what I do... if someone instead frequently accelerates to 90 to go past every other car... well I hope I don't see that guy often on my highway.

This is my commuter car which I drive in the city between 40-60 miles per day. My company garage has free charging station so I pay basically nothing on fuel.

I have gasoline car to drive on a road trip (say places within 250 miles so I am not flying instead). I think almost all Tesla owners have more than one car, so road trip is not an issue.

[pikkagtr]

Originally Posted by Vigilante375

Charging stations.....http://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger Scroll down a tad. They are adding more each year. They are around major roads.

So comparing a M to a family car never intended to compete with an M or anything of that sort.....interesting. Let me show you this comparison of a M to a one:1! Why get an M when its sooooo slow from 60+?

The Tesla was never intended to be fast or a track car. It just happens to be fast from the get go because of the electric motors. Do you need a class on how those things work compared to a gas engine?

Here, lets look at another comparison between something more along the lines of apples to apples. '14 535i x drive vs a '15 70D and '14 S 60.

535i xdrive---------------'14 S 60---------'15 70D
0-60 5.3-------------------5.5---------------5.1
0-100 13.9----------------15.0-------------13.4
50-70 (top gear) 3.8-----2.9---------------3.1
300 ft skid pad .86-------.89---------------.87
weight 4187 lbs----------4323-------------4608
70-0 172 feet-------------174--------------176
1/4 13.9 @ 100-----------14.2 @ 98-------13.8 @ 101

My stats are not ill informed nor misleading. Its yours that misleading. Comparing a car that was never meant to compete with something like a M. Would you like me to give you a comparison of a F80 vs something like a Camaro 1LE? Why spend that much on a M when a 1LE can handle better than a M?

Why so much hate on Tesla? I just don't understand.

My f80 IS a famly car, its a sedan, carries 5 people, great trunk space, comfortable and faster than any Tesla out there.
If you say Tesla was never intended to be a fast car, why are they advertising it as the fastest production sedan ever? A little pretentious don't you think.???
There are fast cars and there are quick car
A car that gets to 100 mph in 2 seconds but is limited to that speed is quick but not fast
A car that can get to 160mph but takes 2minutes is fast but not quick.
The Tesla is a quick car
The f80 is quick AND fast

[GuidoK]

A car that cant lap the nordschleife under 10 minutes certainly isn't a quick car...

(And CERTAINLY not mcLaren F1 quick... just saying....)

[zer0cool]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

A car that cant lap the nordschleife under 10 minutes certainly isn't a quick car...

(And CERTAINLY not mcLaren F1 quick... just saying....)

I don't need to drive on the Nordschleife to go to work, so the lap time does not matter at all. Also, even if I give you a Porsche GT3 RS and put you on the ring tomorrow, I doubt you ll be lapping it in 10 mins anyways.

Of course I read car and drive, motor trend, and care about the lap time, because I am a car enthusiasts. But I fully know those times are made with professional drivers, driving at the top of their ability, in usually perfect conditions. Almost all owners will NEVER approach those numbers, so it's really just bragging rights (of course also the demonstration of engineering prowess by car companies, which I think is very important). I care about those numbers as a car enthusiast, but not as a car user. As a car user, I care about how a car drives from my home to my place of work, where I shop, etc. To say car A is better than car B for my daily drive because car A can run a lap in Germany faster is ridiculous.

[GuidoK]

The over 10 minutes time was set by a professional racing driver who competes in german championships (on the ring).

It can't do 10 minutes because the power supply isn't adequate. Not because the driver couldnt....
That doesnt make it a fast car in my book.

Not that you drive around the ring to go to work, but you also don't need a car that is advertized to be as fast as a mcLaren F1 to go to work. See where I'm getting at? The claims made by Tesla themselves are somewhat ridiculous. They are the ones that boast....
You also don't need 0-60 in 2 seconds (or whatever) for a daily drive.
But 500miles+ range at non-snail speed (thats about 90mph where I live) ? Definately!
And the model S still can't do that. Not by a long way. Range drops dramatically if you want a bit faster and not be a snail on the autobahn.
It's nice at being a commuter car but it hasn't got the range to be really practical.

[The Wind Breezes]

The Tesla isn't designed for long trips and it sure isn't designed for track duty. Even purpose-built electric race cars / bikes have terrible range when being driven flat-out. The energy capacity of even the best batteries is pitiful compared to gasoline.

However, 0-60 is probably THE most important part of around the city driving. The Tesla is already in the ludicrously fast range there, and it isn't exactly slow 60-100. A Chevy Volt, or BMW i3 is really nice for getting off the line fast and quietly and zipping around town, and those cars are NOTHING compared to a Tesla.

Sure, if you want to drive unrestricted on the Autobahn, you're better suited with even a mid-range petrol car...If you want to do track days, or beat people in drag races that go above the 1/8 mile, you'd also best look elsewhere. I don't think anyone is arguing otherwise.

[Z K]

Originally Posted by The Wind Breezes

The Tesla isn't designed for long trips and it sure isn't designed for track duty. Even purpose-built electric race cars / bikes have terrible range when being driven flat-out. The energy capacity of even the best batteries is pitiful compared to gasoline.

However, 0-60 is probably THE most important part of around the city driving. The Tesla is already in the ludicrously fast range there, and it isn't exactly slow 60-100. A Chevy Volt, or BMW i3 is really nice for getting off the line fast and quietly and zipping around town, and those cars are NOTHING compared to a Tesla.

Sure, if you want to drive unrestricted on the Autobahn, you're better suited with even a mid-range petrol car...If you want to do track days, or beat people in drag races that go above the 1/8 mile, you'd also best look elsewhere. I don't think anyone is arguing otherwise.

This is true. That's why I don't feel like spending $90k+ on a commuter car.

If I'm spending that much, the car better be something I FEEL something for and is FUN to drive. The Tesla is not such a car.