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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > General E90 Sedan / E91 Wagon / E92 Coupe / E93 Cabrio > Who's to Blame?



View Poll Results: Whose fault?
Mine 41 62.12%
Brother's 6 9.09%
Combination 19 28.79%
Voters: 66. You may not vote on this poll

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      10-07-2013, 03:51 PM   #1
ase93
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Unhappy Who's to Blame?

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e93 m3
6 speed

Well it all started around 3 months ago, I came around a corner and let it loose a little to much and got completely sideways and corrected but too much and with a little help from a patch of sprinkler water turned it the other way went up a curb pretty much straight on... Well the front bumper, front driver quarter panel, right side skirt and rear rim needed to be replace..

All the repairs were done and the car drives great. Driven over 150 after the accident, no problem. The car is mostly driven in city traffic, again no problem.

This past saturday my brother comes into town and asks to drive, I say yes because he used to have an e46 6 speed and is a very competent driver. He decides to drop the clutch off of a stoplight, wasn't looking to see how high of a rpm and right before he pulls it out of first all I hear is loud metallic grinding noise and he then lets off the gas tries to put it into second and more grinding. Stopped. Got out looked at it and the differential was an inch off the ground. tried to push the car and it wouldn't budge in neutral. tow truck comes. when he trys to pull it on the flat bed with the wench, I hear more grinding noise.. he doesnt say anything about it...

BMW calls me today and after looking at the car they have determined the differential snapped off the subframe and the rear axel cracked.
parts........10,000
labor........3,000

Maybe its a combo of both... maybe the repair shop of the previous accident missed something, and by just simply driving around and doing the burnout just excacerbated the problem.. I don't know just looking for some opinions.

Edit:
Not looking for who needs to pay what.. wrote this when I was pretty upset (3 months after dropping $8,300), "Who's to Blame?" was probably not the right title for the thread. I was more looking for what caused it, and from reading the responses, I see the most probable conclusion is that it was probably was caused by the weakening of the welding from the previous accident.. Any other opinions are welcome.
The guy from the BMW store says they only see this from 'money shifts.' (i.e.: 5th to 4th instead of 6th)
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Last edited by ase93; 10-08-2013 at 02:04 PM.. Reason: refining the question to get the responses more suitable for my question.
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      10-07-2013, 03:58 PM   #2
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You are to blame of course, for driving the car like a maniac under unpredictable conditions and again you for letting your not so competent brother drive your car.
Good luck.
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      10-07-2013, 04:21 PM   #3
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Have to agree, 100% you. Whatever you did to lose control of the car the first go around probably led to the rest. One launch will not tear the rear end out of the car.
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Last edited by The Cleaner; 10-07-2013 at 04:56 PM..
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      10-07-2013, 04:22 PM   #4
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I think that your brother broke your car, but you are to blame.... Candidly, you both sound like idiots to me though. Perhaps you should both stop "letting it loose."

Just my $.02, take it for what it's worth which is probably just that.
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      10-07-2013, 04:33 PM   #5
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I'd say its a combination but mostly your fault. You did the original damage to the car. The original accident is what weakened the welds and bolts and your bro just added the extra stress that it needed to break. There was no way he could have known that would happen. Of course if it were me, I would not be launching anyone else's car unless they told me to do it just because of situations like this.
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      10-07-2013, 04:35 PM   #6
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Perhaps OP should throw away his license and buy a bicycle.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=836344
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      10-07-2013, 04:42 PM   #7
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OP just got his license not long ago.....let him keep it
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      10-07-2013, 05:11 PM   #8
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Nobody drives my car, that takes care of the blame game.
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      10-07-2013, 05:20 PM   #9
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The situation sucks for all parties, but at the end of the day, he didn't do anything that should have broken the car, so you are at fault.

I've had 2 similar (but not so pricey) situations with a car of mine and a friend. First time, he drove it around the block for me (was in storage, I was away), and a part broke due to old age. I replaced it. Second time, we were jacking up the car and he messed up the jack point somehow, and the jack ended up in the side of the door. $1000 for a new door panel. He footed that one.

So it depends, but in this case he had no reason not to do what he did, and should not be held responsible for pre-existing damage to your car.
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      10-07-2013, 07:55 PM   #10
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A combination but mostly your fault. $13K fix? Man that's extreme. Not sure how you divide that up. 80/20? I would buy the parts myself online and take it to an Indy shop. But still the bill is going to be high. Good luck. And never let anyone drive your car unless you have to.
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      10-07-2013, 09:11 PM   #11
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All you buddy. I have no tolerance for irresponsible, and reckless drivers. First it's dangerous, and someone could get seriously hurt. Please keep that driviing behavior Off the streets.
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      10-08-2013, 07:23 AM   #12
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I find it funny how people come onto sites and explain there situations and make themselves look stupid. Enough said.

Last edited by Harry335i; 10-08-2013 at 07:38 AM..
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      10-08-2013, 08:09 AM   #13
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Agree.
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      10-08-2013, 09:58 AM   #14
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100% agree! it is on you. However, I would go back to the insurance company and get them involved, as the first incident more than likely contributed most of the damage.
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      10-08-2013, 10:13 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ny325 View Post
All you buddy. I have no tolerance for irresponsible, and reckless drivers. First it's dangerous, and someone could get seriously hurt. Please keep that driviing behavior Off the streets.
+1
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      10-08-2013, 10:21 AM   #16
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I can't understand why people continue to post these stories?
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      10-08-2013, 10:26 AM   #17
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It pays to play... good luck!
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      10-08-2013, 11:59 AM   #18
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I'm not here ranting trying to get someone else to pay for my car.. He's my brother and one of my best friends. We're just trying to figure out the cause.. Maybe i phrased the question wrong instead of "who's to blame" maybe "What's to blame" would be more appropriate obviously I am at fault.

I know that some of the older m3s had to be recalled because this was happening an abnormally frequent amount of times.
My father Drove a 2010 750Li and right after 60,000 miles (heavy commuter) his transmission failed.. Out of warranty, $10,000.
My Brother's 2007 x5 that he luckily got extended warranty on had a transmission failure just last year, still having to pay the $1,500 deductible.
Another example, someone my father works with who had a 750i had the same thing happen to him, luckily right within warranty.

We thought maybe it was from accident, or from the launch due to long time wear and tear over time (its not like it was the first time the car has been launched and who knows what the first owner did, its 2008 I purchased it in 2010) or a combo of both.

But for everyone here who is saying, maybe you shouldn't let it loose, I can do whatever I damn please with my car, I paid for it (and the damage associated (trying to make some light of the situation)). And also if you don't let your car loose every once and awhile why'd you buy an M? thats what they're for.

Also just in response to Built My Way, hey just move on to the next thread, I enjoy reading about other people's issues, so i figured people might enjoy this.. maybe not.

Lesson learned if you jump curb don't launch your car... and hey try not to hit a curb in the first place.

Upon rereading my original post today it did seem a bit ranty, but as I'm sure you can understand, I would be a bit upset after receiving a phone call that said it was gonna be $13,000 (which i expected, but it doesn't fully sink in until someone tells you).

So really my revised question is, Has this happened to someone's car in the past that hasn't been in a wreck? Maybe its an issue with our family driving (all the cars other than mine are automatic), it just seems to be a reoccurring issue in my circle of BMW drivers.
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      10-08-2013, 12:07 PM   #19
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Doing a hard launch cannot in any way discombobulate the differential. Your brother may drive like a maniac, but it didn't broke the car.

So, its your car, whatever the reason (probably a folowup from your previous accident) it is your problem and not his.
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      10-08-2013, 12:37 PM   #20
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not your brothers fault.
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      10-08-2013, 12:48 PM   #21
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Ok here is my take on it... both of you are idiots tell daddy to buy you a new car!
Letting it lose in a public street is dangerous and looks like too much power for you to handle it and it looks like both you and your brother don't know how to drive!

Maybe next time you'll fully wrap your car around the poll!
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      10-08-2013, 12:54 PM   #22
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Whoever disabled the stability/traction control is at fault. Who could that be?
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