M3 and 135i?

[WangTa]

Hi all,

I'm looking to place an order for an M3 early next year for delivery in June or July of 2009. Just doing some background research on the M3 and keep seeing references to the new 1 series' 135i being "best value" and "almost as quick as the 2008 M3". Watched the youtube clips of the two racing, read the 135 reviews. That 135i 300 hp engine continues to collect rave reviews and the price seems quite resonable. Honestly - I am impressed from what I have seen thus far and it is making me question if the 135i would be a better (more rational) choice.

I have yet to actually see a 135i yet in person, but was curious if anyone else went/is going through this dilemma. Am I retarded for even comparing these two? I didn't think these were even in the same class, but I kept finding 135 vs M stories/articles/comparisons. Apologies if this topic has already been covered - I looked for a thread, but didn't see one. Your input would be appreciated.

[TLud]

Originally Posted by WangTa

Hi all,

I'm looking to place an order for an M3 early next year for delivery in June or July of 2009. Just doing some background research on the M3 and keep seeing references to the new 1 series' 135i being "best value" and "almost as quick as the 2008 M3". Watched the youtube clips of the two racing, read the 135 reviews. That 135i 300 hp engine continues to collect rave reviews and the price seems quite resonable. Honestly - I am impressed from what I have seen thus far and it is making me question if the 135i would be a better (more rational) choice.

I have yet to actually see a 135i yet in person, but was curious if anyone else went/is going through this dilemma. Your thoughts would be appreciated.

No dilemma here. Ignoring the difference in power and delivery, the 135 is only a couple hundred pounds lighter than the M3 and suffers from major understeer, so it really isn't in the same ballpark as the M3 in terms of performance. Pricewise, it's not significantly less than the 335, so I don't think it's the "best value" in BMW's lineup. Also, with its funky rocker panels and goggle-eyed headlights, the 135 doesn't look nearly as good as the M3 or the 335. I had higher hopes for it and have been disappointed in almost all respects. If you're questioning paying the M3's price, I'd look into the 335 instead.

[Robert]

^^ LOL I don't think it has "major" understeer. You can correct that easily with the right foot. Unless you are planning to track your car, I don't think understeer issue will mean much. You are right that it's not the same league as m3 though, but being 20k cheaper helps to bridge the gap. I would pull the trigger on m3 if you have 60-70 to spend or can afford the lease, otherwise 135i is a baby M you may consider.

If I can do over, I would buy an Lotus Elise or Exige. A car with dedicated to one thing, attack the road.

[Big Windy]

You aren't a fool for comparing the two. If you are looking for a car with M characteristics and can't afford an M3, the 135i is your choice. I wouldn't be steered towards a 335i. True, the 135i doesn't have the most attractive front end, but the car romps on the street and the track. Keep reading more reviews. I was in this same situation for a little bit and then decided to go for the M3 after seeing them both IRL and realizing that I would be making a huge sacrifice/compromise to go into the 135i.

[WangTa]

To be honest, I will most likely NOT be driving to the point where I will need to worry about understeer I live in a city - I'll be happy if I hit 50 when not on a highway. Have you guys seen a 1 series? I'm wondering if it will be to small? It looks tiny!

Things that deter me from the 1 series: I have a feeling I will start seeing many on the road, which makes it more mainstream. I also have a feeling I'll see alot of woman driving it - perhaps to the same number as the Lexus IS series! Call me materialistic or whatever - but a part of me wants to have something somewhat exclusive as well as "manly". Ok, throw me the jokes - "he must be compensating for something, blah blah". I might be as shallow as a puddle when it comes to my car - but I'm just being honest!

However, the performance of the 1 does seem impressive. You guys aren't impressed at all? Near m3 performance, for 20K cheaper? I am not sure I like the taller, upright look of the 1. However, I perused www.1addicts.com (1 series FENATICS) and some of them have some nice looking cars.

[montreal red]

the 1 series is a boys car... get a 3 series coupe... no matter how hard a 1er is modded, i dont think it can look as good as a modded 3er... i have yet to see a smoking hot 1er...

[The Shiekh]

2 words will answer ALL your questions...Drive BOTH. That's it, it will tell you what you need to know about each car. What will you do with the car? No tracking? Get the M3 because well, why the f**k not??? Want a small fast car but is NOT an M, get the 1er. I drove the 135i, it is fast and a fun lttle car. Being 6'2 215lb is a bit hard on me though. Really, just drive both. If you are SERIOUS at a bmw dealer, they will let you

[lvwirelessguy]

Originally Posted by WangTa

To be honest, I will most likely NOT be driving to the point where I will need to worry about understeer I live in a city - I'll be happy if I hit 50 when not on a highway. Have you guys seen a 1 series? I'm wondering if it will be to small? It looks tiny!

Things that deter me from the 1 series: I have a feeling I will start seeing many on the road, which makes it more mainstream. I also have a feeling I'll see alot of woman driving it - perhaps to the same number as the Lexus IS series! Call me materialistic or whatever - but a part of me wants to have something somewhat exclusive as well as "manly". Ok, throw me the jokes - "he must be compensating for something, blah blah". I might be as shallow as a puddle when it comes to my car - but I'm just being honest!

However, the performance of the 1 does seem impressive. You guys aren't impressed at all? Near m3 performance, for 20K cheaper? I am not sure I like the taller, upright look of the 1. However, I perused www.1addicts.com (1 series FENATICS) and some of them have some nice looking cars.

I don't think most people here will take you seriously when you are comparing a 135i & a M3. Seems like the 135i is more in your price range.

[GnokGnik]

the 1 series is ugly imho, if you are not gonna track your car why not get a good looking one?

+1
335i or M3

btw, might wanna check out this thread:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=157788

[WangTa]

Originally Posted by lvwirelessguy

I don't think most people here will take you seriously when you are comparing a 135i & a M3. Seems like the 135i is more in your price range.

Haha, I like the slight diss and presumption I cannot afford the mighty m3. Perhaps I didn't mention this, but I can afford either car. I always do alot of research before any purchase (hell, even a new cell phone) and just want to make sure it makes sense. Just my analytical, 360 approach to investing (which I do for a living) in anything.

As I said before, I haven't seen either of the cars in person - haven't had time and I'm still a couple months away from buying. Thanks for your comment though, lvwirelessguy - very very insightful...

Thanks Shiekh for the info - I'm 6'1 so I'm guessing it will be a tight squeeze into the 1 eh?

[WangTa]

Originally Posted by GnokGnik

the 1 series is ugly imho, if you are not gonna track your car why not get a good looking one?

+1
335i or M3

btw, might wanna check out this thread:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=157788

Great read GnokGnik! Thanks!

[Robert]

Originally Posted by WangTa

Haha, I like the slight diss and presumption I cannot afford the mighty m3. Perhaps I didn't mention this, but I can afford either car. I always do alot of research before any purchase (hell, even a new cell phone) and just want to make sure it makes sense. Just my analytical, 360 approach to investing (which I do for a living) in anything.

As I said before, I haven't seen either of the cars in person - haven't had time and I'm still a couple months away from buying. Thanks for your comment though, lvwirelessguy - very very insightful...

Thanks Shiekh for the info - I'm 6'1 so I'm guessing it will be a tight squeeze into the 1 eh?

People are real class act aren't they?

I would rather ride the T with a Charlie Card if I live in Boston, though.

[WangTa]

Originally Posted by bobbo

People are real class act aren't they?

I would rather ride the T with a Charlie Card if I live in Boston, though.

I hear you. I lived in NYC for 5 years, and didn't need a car for obvious reasons. Boston is much the same - don't really have a need for a car here. But next year, the story changes - and I'm starting to really dig into the details on my short list of potential cars, options, timing and the automobile purchasing environment, insurance and the like. This will be my very first NEW car, and the M3 has always been my #1 dream car. It would be a lifelong achievement to finaly own one. My goal was to buy a new M3 before OIL is depleted or $15/gallon!

[argonboy]

I see some of the people replying own M3s, some just want to contribute...

The M3 is amazing overall, the DCT gearbox is also impressive. However if you just want a fast car, maybe even automatic, but you don't really care about being a guy with the M3, get the 135i or maybe the 335xi Coupe (and you won't have traction problems).

The videos of the cars racing don't really mean much. Where the cars excel is at how they feel when you drive them. IMO, there are two extremes of M3 owners, hardcore M people, and those who want to be seen driving an M3, and we're all in the middle.

Oh, and the M3 doesn't ensure you will never understeer, it just makes it more obvious where that will occur.

[booforty]

135i is not that great looking in the flesh and does not have the same presence and "wow" factor as the M3...

[dawgdog]

I was at the track last weekend and I met a man with a fairly new 135. He came from a 335 and has owned M cars. He is fairly experienced on the track was was very dissappointed in how "floaty" the 1 was. He felt the 335 had much better suspension, and plans on adding KW coilovers and swaybars to correct the 1's defeciencies.

[theslik1]

Originally Posted by WangTa

...I have a feeling I will start seeing many on the road, which makes it more mainstream. I also have a feeling I'll see alot of woman driving it - perhaps to the same number as the Lexus IS series!

Based on allocations (generally), you'll be far more likely to see an M3 on the road than a 1-series of any type. BMW simply isn't bringing many 1's over and that's unlikely to change until the dollar improves.

You might be right about the gender distribution, though.

[clubspec330i]

People need to drive 135i before making a bias opinion. Stop reading the magazine and belief everything you read..

When I had my E90 for 1200 miles service, I got 135i for a loaner. Ok..at least it was not a Kia for a loaner car. At the end of the day, the car's performance really impressed me. For a lightly equiped 135i, 6spd auto and premium - this thing can be had for less than $40k and yet it came very close to M3 performance.

Last Saturday, I took my E90 and wife's step E92 335 to AutoX. Surprisingly, 335i with stock sport suspension and crappy tires came about 4.3 sec. short of the M3. I am confident that stick 135i with PS2 or better tire and KW3, it would run right on M3's bumper. Maybe 3.91 LSD would help too.

Good luck with either car...

For those who think people with 1 series can't afford M3, think again..
On Saturday, I met a guy who track his 997 GT3 and use 135i as a daily beater... Now, you tell me if he can afford M3 or not. Maybe not, since he probably spent too much on his GT3

[TLud]

Originally Posted by clubspec330i

People need to drive 135i before making a bias opinion. Stop reading the magazine and belief everything you read..

Good point, and I'd like some more time behind the wheel of a 135, especially on the track, before I come to any ultimate conclusions. From my brief solo test drive, the car seemed fidgety and much less composed around corners than either the 335 or the M3. I also had difficulty smoothly throttle steering, for which BMW is normally famous. The 135 also wasn't as settled over Houston's jacked up roads. That being said, a number of drivers apparently have been able to dial the car in nicely with a few relatively simple and inexpensive modifications.

Looks are subjective, but something about the 135 seems out of proportion to me: like it's a little too tall for its length. Some colors seem to hide this better than others.

Another consideration that I don't think has been mentioned, if you'd prefer something like the DCT, it obviously isn't available in the 1 series yet.

[WangTa]

Originally Posted by clubspec330i

People need to drive 135i before making a bias opinion. Stop reading the magazine and belief everything you read..

When I had my E90 for 1200 miles service, I got 135i for a loaner. Ok..at least it was not a Kia for a loaner car. At the end of the day, the car's performance really impressed me. For a lightly equiped 135i, 6spd auto and premium - this thing can be had for less than $40k and yet it came very close to M3 performance.

Last Saturday, I took my E90 and wife's step E92 335 to AutoX. Surprisingly, 335i with stock sport suspension and crappy tires came about 4.3 sec. short of the M3. I am confident that stick 135i with PS2 or better tire and KW3, it would run right on M3's bumper. Maybe 3.91 LSD would help too.

Good luck with either car...

For those who think people with 1 series can't afford M3, think again..
On Saturday, I met a guy who track his 997 GT3 and use 135i as a daily beater... Now, you tell me if he can afford M3 or not. Maybe not, since he probably spent too much on his GT3

Sorry, what is AutoX? and PS2, KW3 and LSD?

Purchasing the 135i isn't always based on $$ - my friend is about to pull the trigger on one too, and could easily afford an M3. His rationale - new model, "quicker", size (he's 5'5" - he think he looks bigger in it, haha), and value - he likes the idea of getting more for less. But I gurantee you he will get fully loaded version and pimp it out - I'm guessing in the end, it will be pretty darn pricey to say the least.

Curious what people thought of the interior of the 135i? I know some people here don't care about the interior - "its about the car's performance" - yeah, I understand - but here in SoCal, you spend so much damn time in your car due to traffic, its nice to have a plush cockpit (and I love gadgets).

[TLud]

Originally Posted by WangTa

Sorry, what is AutoX? and PS2, KW3 and LSD?

AutoX = Auto-cross (a short course with lots of tight turns is set up and the goal is to be the fastest person in your vehicle class around the the course)

PS2 = Michelin Pilot Sport 2 tires

KW3 = type of coilover suspension kit

LSD = Limited Slip Differential

[adamr]

mmm ... tough choice ... but like one poster said drive them both! ... and you decide ... or buy them both!!! then no regrets on your chocie!!!